Transcript of 86th Session between Charles Balis, M.D. and Ms. Anna Green, Thursday, July 2, 1998 at 4:00 pm.

Ms. Green: Hello, Doctor Balis.
Dr. Balis: Hello, Anna. Please come in. How's life?
Ms. Green: It has its moments.
Dr. Balis: I see.
Ms. Green: One of Kathy's patrons died.
Dr. Balis: Oh no. Is...
Ms. Green: It wasn't like it was Kathy's fault. Really.
Dr. Balis: That's good. What happened?
Ms. Green: Apparently he committed suicide.
Dr. Balis: Hmm.
Ms. Green: Kathy told me about this guy. He was nineteen or something, very young. She said that he was strange--he wanted to be punished. He even gave Kathy a script over the phone that she had to follow when they did it.
Dr. Balis: A script?
Ms. Green: I didn't see it. The first time...
Dr. Balis: Kathy saw this guy more than once?
Ms. Green: She saw him a couple of times. He was one of her first customers, and he became a regular. Kathy told me that she thought he was very depressed. She even refused to have a session with him two weeks ago because when she got there, he was too fucked up.
Dr. Balis: Was he under influence?
Ms. Green: Kathy said she couldn't tell. But he was crying and raving about being the lowest person on Earth--not worthy of having a life.
Dr. Balis: What did Kathy do?
Ms. Green: She actually called me from his kitchen. She said the guy, Peter, was screaming like a lunatic. I asked if she was worried for her safety, but she said no. He was just too much for her. I told her to get out of there, and she did. I don't understand why the police are so taken with Kathy now.
Dr. Balis: Is Kathy under investigation?
Ms. Green: Not really. The guy jumped out of a fifth story window at four o'clock in the morning. Kathy was home, and I can testify to that. He also left a note for his parents. I don't know what it said.
Dr. Balis: I see. How do the police know about Kathy?
Ms. Green: She's not hiding what she's doing. She is not working as a prostitute; she's just beating guys for money. That's not particularly illegal. She said that they found her number in his stuff.
Dr. Balis: Did the police ask you questions?
Ms. Green: Yes. Two detectives came to the house. I told them what I knew, which wasn't much. But I said that Kathy has been staying with me for the past couple of months. I told them the business she was in. I didn't hide anything. And I said that I knew she was at home the night it happened.
Dr. Balis: And?
Ms. Green: And they seemed to be satisfied with that.
Dr. Balis: When did all of this happen?
Ms. Green: I think he jumped on Friday, I guess that would be Saturday morning.
Dr. Balis: When was the last time Kathy saw him?
Ms. Green: The previous Monday. That was their date night.
Dr. Balis: I thought you said that Kathy refused to service him?
Ms. Green: That was two...three weeks ago. Last week, he was all right. He called and left this long begging message telling us what a good boy he was going to be from now on.
Dr. Balis: Us? Have you ever talked with him?
Ms. Green: Two weeks ago, when Kathy refused to be with him, he called the house about ten times.
Dr. Balis: I thought you changed your number.
Ms. Green: No, I got a new number installed, and Kathy arranged to have my old number.
Dr. Balis: I see. So you talked with him?
Ms. Green: I just got tired of the constant ringing and pleading. I told him that he has to work it out with Kathy. He begged for my help, and...and nothing. I didn't do anything.
Dr. Balis: Hmm. Did Kathy think he might have been suicidal at the time?
Ms. Green: No. Why would she?
Dr. Balis: You said she thought he was depressed?
Ms. Green: I'm depressed sometimes, too. But it doesn't mean I'm going to jump. She's not a psychiatrist, and we told the detectives that.
Dr. Balis: Hmm. So you don't think there was any relationship between Kathy's dominatrix services and Peter's suicide?
Ms. Green: I don't know. Not directly. The guy wanted to be punished and reassured that he was the lowest of the low. A lot of guys want that from Kathy--most of them don't jump afterwards.
Dr. Balis: Kathy is offering services that work on multiple levels.
Ms. Green: I'd say.
Dr. Balis: Wait, Anna. What I'm trying to say is that the raw emotions released while someone is experiencing bottom space, as you call it, can sometimes be more than the individual is ready to handle. If Peter was depressed, he might have used Kathy to help him reaffirm his decision to end his life.
Ms. Green: Hmm.
Dr. Balis: How does Kathy feel about this?
Ms. Green: She's freaked. But she doesn't think it was her fault. She just did as she was asked. It was completely consensual.
Dr. Balis: Does she still have the script?
Ms. Green: No. She brought it over to his place the first time she met him. I would gather the police have it, if he hasn't destroyed it, of course.
Dr. Balis: Hmm. Is Kathy going to continue with her practice after this?
Ms. Green: Yes. I think she is really good at what she does, Doctor. And I think she probably offers a much needed service--there are a lot of guys who want to be in that bottom space and there aren't a lot of women who can put them there. The few women who like to top tend to be in relationships and don't play around with too many outsiders.
Dr. Balis: Hmm.
Ms. Green: If it's not Kathy, it would be someone else, perhaps less qualified. At least Kathy knows how to do it right. And she also plays the other way, which gives her a certain degree of empathy, I think.
Dr. Balis: And how do you feel about this?
Ms. Green: I don't know. I've never been so close to someone who actually took his own life. It's unsettling. And I don't like talking to the police. I don't want to be involved.
Dr. Balis: Are you pushing Kathy to move out of your home?
Ms. Green: Yes. We talked about her getting an apartment soon.
Dr. Balis: How soon?
Ms. Green: She says she almost has the money for all the fees that she would need to pay. I feel it's getting close, Doctor.
Dr. Balis: Good. Please don't let up on her. Make sure she knows just how much you want her out of there.
Ms. Green: Oh, I think she knows. We've been fighting quite a lot lately, and this Peter thing didn't help.
Dr. Balis: Good. Did anything else happen last week that you'd like to talk about?
Ms. Green: I went to one of Kathy's appointments again. Don't worry--I didn't masturbate in public again. I was there as a videographer.
Dr. Balis: Hmm?
Ms. Green: This couple wanted to videotape the session so they could watch it again and again. Kathy asked me to do it. And that's all.
Dr. Balis: Did you like it?
Ms. Green: There's definitely a thrill in watching others have sex in front of you.
Dr. Balis: But Kathy doesn't...
Ms. Green: Kathy didn't. The couple did everything. They had sex together, Kathy was there to tell them what to do--she was the ring master, as the guy put it. And she had a whip to prove it, too.
Dr. Balis: Does watching fulfills all your S&M fantasies?
Ms. Green: It's not a fantasy per se. It's more like another approach to having sex. And, yes, observing Kathy's customers in action pretty much does it for me.
Dr. Balis: Do you still want to be topped?
Ms. Green: Yes. But I'm willing to wait for just the right guy. And I'm not sure I would want to do it the way that couple did it. I don't want to have someone else there. I want the man I'm with to...I want to feel the power. There is a reason why men are always depicted with giant muscles and powerful chests and women are shown draping their bodies all over them and wearing nothing but ripped transparent shirts.
Dr. Balis: What are we talking about?
Ms. Green: The covers of stupid romance novels.
Dr. Balis: Hmm.
Ms. Green: I don't really read that stuff. Don't worry, Doctor, I still have my IQ intact. But there is a reason why so many women like reading these stories. I think they like to imagine how it would feel to have this raw power over them...they want to be topped. I like being pinned by a man so I can't move my arms and legs. I like feeling the power. S&M is more than that, I know. But that's exciting. I like the feeling of losing control during sex. I think lots of women do. But look, we're out of time. I'll see you next week, Doctor. And don't worry, Kathy will move out eventually.
Dr. Balis: All right. Take care, Anna. I'll see you next week.
Ms. Green: Goodbye, Doctor.
Dr. Balis: Goodbye.
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